Here's a link to the foot note of Howl https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems-and-poets/poems/detail/54163
Take a look at that and give your thoughts of what you've read. In your response talk a little about what your understanding of the last two section of Howl, looking up Moloch and Carl Solomon for instance would be very helpful in this process. I mentioned in class that the last two sections were added later, why do you think Ginsberg felt the need to go back and add them? We also also talked about the morality of the people discussed in this poem. Should these minds be considered the best? Why are they they way that Ginsberg described them in part one, in your opinion? Answer as many of these questions as you can (it's fine to not have a clear cut definite answer too) and be ready to talk about the details of and points of confusion in the poem in class tomorrow.
I found the second part of Howl harder to understand than the others. The first part, I understood as an intense, mad, and frenzied description of the outsiders of society. The third part made sense to me as well. For me, it felt like a more in depth dedication to Carl Solomon and an explanation of their time in the mental hospital. It was the second part that feels out of place. It reads like a random compilation of Ginsberg’s wishes and hopes for society. He tells us what he believes society needs to “Moloch” or sacrifice. Although this is an interesting concept, it feels out of place in this poem that is meant to inspire the outsiders. Unlike the second part, I understand and accept the third part of the poem as a valuable addition.
ReplyDeleteI believe that whether or not the men that Ginsberg described in the first part can be rightfully called the “best minds of their generation” depends on what the reader decides what determine that title. In terms of innovation, daringness, intensity, and passion, it can be argued that these men were the best of the generation. Whether or not the things that these men did were unexplainably dangerous and idiotic, their passion for stepping outside of society awarded them the title. On the other hand, in terms of sanity and less radical standards, these men would not be considered the best minds and would instead be considered insane.
In my opinion, the men that Ginsberg described in part 1 acted the way they did to test society's and their own boundaries. In the last couple days of class, we spoke about the “Levittown” lifestyle and the stereotypical 50’s household. The Beats and the men that Ginsberg described are the ones that attempted to escape this lifestyle in every possible way they could. This fight to escape helped to create the tortured artists that Ginsberg speaks of. Although many took the fight too far, their intense and daring attitude towards breaking away from society is extraordinarily admirable
In section 1 of Howl, Ginsberg focuses specifically on the messy and complex lives of beat writers and what it was like to be an outcast. He shows how “the ideal 1950’s lifestyle” and the culture of the 1950’s “destroyed the best minds of his generation.” In section 2, he delves into the 1950s culture that the beats rebelled against. He talks about “Moloch,” which literally is the biblical name for a canaanite god associated with child sacrifice, and in this poem it symbolizes war, conformity, social oppression, capitalism, the levittown lifestyle, corporate power, and all of the things that the beats were against. In Part 3, Ginsburg writes specifically about Carl Solomon, who suffered from serious mental illness. Solomon had gone mad, so most people just dismissed him as crazy, but ginsburg saw his intelligence. I think Ginsburg added these sections in order provide a fuller picture of what it was like to be a beat.
ReplyDeleteAlthough not everything the beats did was morally great, I do believe they were some of the best minds of their generation. They were not what you would typically consider to be “intellectual,” but they were intellectuals in their own ways. They were outsiders. They were able to see what was wrong with society and stand up for what they thought was right. The 1950’s culture or the “Moloch” made the beats go crazy.
The last parts were much easier to grasp. It probably had to do with Ginsberg's constant repetition of words. The last parts felt like Ginsberg was writing/addressing to a specific person, possibly being Carl Solomon who he met at a mental hospital. I read that they instantly clicked and they both had a love for Russian literature. It's kind of interesting because when we think of Russians we (at least I) think of vulgar words being used. Much like the poem Howl included. It seemed like Solomon understood Ginsberg and that translated into the 3rd part of the poem. He repeats "I'm with you in Rockland" meaning he stands by whoever he may be talking about. Maybe Ginsberg added these last two parts because he met Solomon. I think Ginsberg believes who he writes about is the best because they're the radicals the ones who are defying the social norms. The ones who are struggling.
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ReplyDeleteI found that the second and third parts of Howl were very different from the first. In the first part of the poem, the subject is the best minds of Ginsberg's generation. However, each line starts with who, which creates a questioning tone to the writing. When reading the second section of Howl, I felt that it was answering the first section. The first section was saying "who" and the second section was answering Moloch. Moloch was a god who was associated with children sacrifice. While reading the second section of the poem, I interpreted that Ginsberg used Moloch to symbolize evil and destruction. Ginsberg describes Moloch as inhumane. For example, he compares Moloch's mind to machinery, showing that he lacks human emotion. I think that Moloch could represent communism or mainstream society because Ginsberg viewed them as destructive monsters that destroy love and human individualism. I think that the second section of Howl elaborated specifically on how humans were being destroyed. I think that maybe Ginsberg added this section to the poem later because people were very shocked, angry and confused about the poem. In my opinion, the second part of Howl was easier to understand. I could clearly see Ginsberg's views on the evils of society. Ginsberg might have wanted to clear up the confusion with more sections, however, this could have just led people to be more confused. The third section of Howl was very intense. I felt that with each line I read, that I was further exploring the madness of Carl Solomon. Ginsberg did a good job of describing all the hallucinations Carl Solomon had and the complexity of Carl's mind. I think that in the third section of Howl, Ginsberg explored the inhumanity of our country's mental institutions. Ginsberg argued that humans should not be punished for having individual, radical ideas. I also found it interesting how Ginsberg could relate to Solomon's insanity, specifically when dealing with his own mother, for she was mentally ill too. I think that Ginsberg considered the Beats to be the best minds because they were individuals. I think it is important to focus on the word mind because mind is associated with free will and intelligence. Those who follow society's desires and do not think individually are not using their minds at all and are not living up to their potential.
ReplyDeleteI liked sections II and III better than I. I think part of it was that the repetition throughout each segment made not only the point, but also the subject of the writing a lot clearer. Section II and III were filled with a more terrifying side to this dark lifestyle, while section I was focused more on the outsider group (not necessarily a scary thing). This part dives deeper than the depression and drug use and prostitution that we saw in section I, and highlights personal insanity. I think this, on top of section one, makes a very meaningful piece of literature. To me, part III especially, is the most personal part of this work over all. He seems to have the most connection. It seems like a call for help, from what I understand, to help him through his insanity. I think this is partly why he added this later. In class, we talked about his life and how he lead a depressing one. He faced a lot of challenges that were commonly frowned upon during this time period. I believe, after reading this, that these challenges eventually got to him. This could contribute to his declining sense of sanity. Overall, I enjoyed these two sections of "Howl" more than the first one.
ReplyDeleteI think that though the second and third parts were easier to understand, however I think that the first part painted a better picture of what life as a Beat was like. The way that the other parts went in to detail give more insight into Ginsberg's life, but I think that this was less effective because the work was more powerful to me when it was not biographical. The pretty detailed descriptions of Moloch and Solomon are powerful in a different way because they show a darker side to ginsberg's life and his struggles with depression and mental illness alongside Solomon. The personal side to "Howl" is good because of it brings emphasis on the personal experiences of the Beat writer and can be used as evidence that the claims of "Howl" were actually true and not just angry prose.
ReplyDeleteReading the second and third part, I found them much easier to grasp. They were not very overwhelming and I felt that they were much more clear. One of the reasons I believe I felt this way, was because all of the repetition. When I started reading part two, I wasn't sure who Moloch was. After looking it up, I learned that Moloch is a biblical name that is related to a god associated with child sacrifice. I also found that a Moloch is something possessing the power to exact severe sacrifice. After looking that up, it made section two so much more clear to me. I think that the message of part two, was Ginsberg's way of elaborating on the problems with the world; the society in which he lives in. One line that real stuck with me from that section was, "Moloch! Solitude! Filth! Ugliness! Ashcans and unobtainable dollars! Children screaming under the stairways! Boys sobbing in armies! Old men weeping in the parks!". That quote, tentatively, speaks to the Moloch definition, the sacrifice of children and in a broader sense, the sacrifices on society that Ginsberg criticizes.
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